Curse

Howling Wind · Aug 29, 2005, 06:37 PM // 18:37

Most powerful single spell IMO to prevent shutdown is Spellbreaker since most hexes and nrg denial spells are well spells. Spellbreaker doesn't last long but your well protected for that little while.

Only thing you got to worry about is a ranger during that period and a hammer warrior, which you could use dolyak signet and balanced stance to counter its knockdown. Or just sprint.

Swiffle · Aug 29, 2005, 07:21 PM // 19:21

[03:14] <LoneDust> instead of "post reply" they should have a "shoot this guy" button

/signed

Mhydrian · Aug 29, 2005, 10:55 PM // 22:55

Balanced stance helps, running then using reversal of fortune, using signet of devotion to heal past backfire, being careful and watching all the mesmer hexes like diversion and backfire. Bring hex removals. if you go tactics for balanced stance, bring heal sig for self heals is a good option, and it gets around backfire. But you still need something fast casting as well.

octaviancmb · Aug 29, 2005, 11:38 PM // 23:38

Mantra of Resolve is your best bet...well, short of just not playing. You've still got knockdown to worry about and energy denial, but there's no way to avoid everything while still being at all useful to your team.

As one poster said, Spellbreaker will give you a bit of respite from spell-based shutdown if you really want to waste your elite slot for around 15 seconds of spell protection.

Coordination with your team is key. If you're being harrassed by a Mesmer or Ranger, send your team members over to return the favor. Use the fact that most Monks (inexplicably) don't pay attention to Mesmers or Rangers on their team to your advantage.

Good luck,
cmb

Evisicator · Aug 30, 2005, 07:04 AM // 07:04

just dont log in to play the game. that's the best way to counter shutdown.

there is no way around shutdown, there are certain precautions against types of shutdown but, you aren't going to be immune to all shutdown all the time.

ElderAtronach · Aug 30, 2005, 07:22 AM // 07:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mhydrian

Balanced stance helps, running then using reversal of fortune, using signet of devotion to heal past backfire, being careful and watching all the mesmer hexes like diversion and backfire. Bring hex removals. if you go tactics for balanced stance, bring heal sig for self heals is a good option, and it gets around backfire. But you still need something fast casting as well.

LOL @ heal sig. Congratulations, you have 20 armor now. Have fun taking craploads of extra damage, you might as well run frenzy on that monk and shoot your wand faster.

Kabale · Aug 30, 2005, 01:07 PM // 13:07

Quote:

Use the fact that most Monks (inexplicably) don't pay attention to Mesmers or Rangers on their team to your advantage.

Ehm talk about generalization.

Anyways, OT, best bet (if you're a monk) is just to run and stay within reach of another healer (if applicable). You'll be keeping a few people busy anyway, because you'll have picked up a few people joining in the chase, giving your team vital seconds to deal some of their own damage. I'm not particularily scared of these blackout warriors, they are merely a nuisance, which in many cases is enough to be effective.
As for mesmers with a few more domination skills to back it up between the blackouts...then you've got issues

zehly · Aug 30, 2005, 10:50 PM // 22:50

The only problem with running is that... when you're running, you're not healing

And if you stop to heal, blackout will catch up, so you run some more while blackout recharges.

Entropius · Aug 30, 2005, 11:16 PM // 23:16

Use different techniques depending on what sort of shutdown it is:

--Interrupts: Use quick-casting spells (Infuse Health, Reversal of Fortune, Protective Spirit, etc.) If the interrupts are used in combination with Migraine or Arcane Conundrum, use hex defense. If you really need it, there's always Mantra/Glyph of Concentration. Obsidian Flesh or Spellbreaker can also be used.

--Hexes that deal damage (Backfire, Soul Leech): Use hex defense, or use Protective Spirit and cast through them.

--Ranger interrupts: Use quick-casting spells, or use block/evade skills

--Energy denial: Keep +15/-1 items on weapon switch and switch to those when drained, then use an energy recovery skill and switch back. If necessary, use them to "hide energy": use your main weapons to recover energy (going, say, from -30 to -25), then switch to the -15/+1 items, cast a spell, and switch back. (This is what you do if you get drained far into the negatives. Try not to let it get to this point.)

Alternatively, play an alternate primary, for Ether Renewal, Ether Prodigy, Glyph of Lesser Energy, Soul Reaping, or the like. My main heal build is an E/Mo who uses Ether Renewal, and energy drains bounce off of me like water from a duck's back. (Not to get into a debate about the effectiveness of E/Mo healers here, but one thing you can't do to disable them is drain them.)

--Hammer knockdowns: Use quick-casting spells in the time between knockdowns (Protective Spirit, Reversal of Fortune), or use Evasion skills. Remove the Weakness so Heavy Blow isn't a knockdown.

--Spell knockdows: Not much you can do about the one-off Meteor or Earthquake. If you go up against a Stoning-happy Elementalist or something (they exist, and are brutal) get the Weakness removed. Against Gale, you'll have to settle for Spell Breaker, Obsidian Flesh, waiting until the Ele gets exhausted (which could take a while), or killing the Ele.

Dolyak Signet sucks.

Amused Observer · Aug 31, 2005, 04:03 AM // 04:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by zehly

The only problem with running is that... when you're running, you're not healing

And if you stop to heal, blackout will catch up, so you run some more while blackout recharges.

Ding! That's the whole point of using blackout!

Prevent the healer/protector from doing just that!

The problem w/ spellbreaker is that recast time is 45 seconds. Blackout's recharge is a mere 10 seconds. So. . . if you use SB, it'll protect you from the first blackout, but not the second. Not a great use of the elite slot, imo.

Mhydrian · Aug 31, 2005, 04:07 AM // 04:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by ElderAtronach

LOL @ heal sig. Congratulations, you have 20 armor now. Have fun taking craploads of extra damage, you might as well run frenzy on that monk and shoot your wand faster.

20 less armor for 2 seconds not as big a deal as people think. Spamming heal sig for my R/W W/? build is the best way to outlast enemy casters. If you are relying on a signet for healing whilst being beat on by alot of melee as a monk, maybe rethink your strategy anyways eh? Obviously a 2 second cast heal is situationally valuable. At 9 tactics 107 health is nothing to sneeze at. If you have alot of melee on you and backfire, you can kiss your ass goodbye no matter what you do.

Some posters here boggle me really. They try to sound witty by placing a skill in a situation where it is obviously not practical to use. Every skill in this game has drawbacks, hence the balance, for getting around backfire and other nasty hexes, dots, and even a melee -20 armor for 2 seconds isnt going to matter diddly.

Player skill and being creative, using skills and understanding drawbacks and advantages win matches. I have no problem using a heal sig in PVP. There are times when I cant rely on it, but most of the time its a very useful tactic. And i rarely run a M/W build in any case. But I have experimented around alot of builds, and especially if you are running heavy enchants and using pro spirit heal sig is perefectly fine. But of course this is me thinking and being creative....

If you have 2+ melee beating on you with backfire and probably DOT's, you are probably going to die unless you are not snared. 10 seconds of not casting is death, trying to remove hex and and suffering a backfire blast in the process probably death. Signet of devotion is a good option if you have divine favor high, healing boon can heal through backfire somewhat. But doubtful anything you do would save you from this situation.

Put a skill in an impossible situation and it will fail everytime. Whats your point exactly?

Putting yourself in situations where the skills you have chosen are effective is what this game is all about.

Savio · Aug 31, 2005, 04:14 AM // 04:14

It's not 20 less armor, it's 40. For a Mo/W, that means he's got 20 armor. You're the one who suggested Healing Signet, not him. Why would Rangers and Warriors have Tactics anyhow? Get it straight; we're talking about primary Monks, not your R/W or whatever. And yes, -40 armor WILL matter in 2 seconds.

QuixotesGhost · Aug 31, 2005, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amused Observer

Ding! That's the whole point of using blackout!

Prevent the healer/protector from doing just that!

The problem w/ spellbreaker is that recast time is 45 seconds. Blackout's recharge is a mere 10 seconds. So. . . if you use SB, it'll protect you from the first blackout, but not the second. Not a great use of the elite slot, imo.

Actually Blackout is a skill and therefore isn't stopped by spell breaker. There are very few ways to defend against it. Primarily: RUN AWAY!

UberRusty · Aug 31, 2005, 05:12 AM // 05:12

Blackout is incredibly powerful, and basically, is powerful enough to be an elite.

Quote:

20 less armor for 2 seconds not as big a deal as people think.

IF you weren't getting attacked, not even a deal. But the fact that you WILL get attacked means you will be taking more damage than you will be healing with Healing Signet. And putting Tactics JUST for Healing Signet is iffy, might as well use something such as Bonetti's Defence. OR, you could use Signet of Devotion and not take the risk.

Quote:

Have fun taking craploads of extra damage, you might as well run frenzy on that monk and shoot your wand faster.

Holy crap, that's Flavor of the Next Week. Frenzied wanding ftw.

Amused Observer · Sep 01, 2005, 05:40 AM // 05:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by QuixotesGhost

Actually Blackout is a skill and therefore isn't stopped by spell breaker. There are very few ways to defend against it. Primarily: RUN AWAY!

oh wow! I didn't realize SB can't stop blackout! Thx for the correction!

cookiehoarder · Sep 01, 2005, 07:11 PM // 19:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mhydrian

20 less armor for 2 seconds not as big a deal as people think. Spamming heal sig for my R/W W/? build is the best way to outlast enemy casters. If you are relying on a signet for healing whilst being beat on by alot of melee as a monk, maybe rethink your strategy anyways eh? Obviously a 2 second cast heal is situationally valuable. At 9 tactics 107 health is nothing to sneeze at. If you have alot of melee on you and backfire, you can kiss your ass goodbye no matter what you do.

Some posters here boggle me really. They try to sound witty by placing a skill in a situation where it is obviously not practical to use. Every skill in this game has drawbacks, hence the balance, for getting around backfire and other nasty hexes, dots, and even a melee -20 armor for 2 seconds isnt going to matter diddly.

Player skill and being creative, using skills and understanding drawbacks and advantages win matches. I have no problem using a heal sig in PVP. There are times when I cant rely on it, but most of the time its a very useful tactic. And i rarely run a M/W build in any case. But I have experimented around alot of builds, and especially if you are running heavy enchants and using pro spirit heal sig is perefectly fine. But of course this is me thinking and being creative....

If you have 2+ melee beating on you with backfire and probably DOT's, you are probably going to die unless you are not snared. 10 seconds of not casting is death, trying to remove hex and and suffering a backfire blast in the process probably death. Signet of devotion is a good option if you have divine favor high, healing boon can heal through backfire somewhat. But doubtful anything you do would save you from this situation.

Put a skill in an impossible situation and it will fail everytime. Whats your point exactly?

Putting yourself in situations where the skills you have chosen are effective is what this game is all about.

If a team EVER sees you using healing sig. They will wait till you use it JUST to spike you dead.

I've been thinking about it really....You need troll unguent on your monks. That's teh shiz

ElderAtronach · Sep 01, 2005, 07:23 PM // 19:23

Why is there even a debate about heal sig on monk primary? It's -40 armor. For 2 seconds of their team hating on you. When else would you use it, at near full health? When not being attacked? You can't use heal sig on others.

Sig of devotion ftw.

Almighty Zi · Sep 03, 2005, 09:00 PM // 21:00

I play a ranger/mesmer in 4v4 PVP and I always look out for monks using signets. Blessed, devotion, healing, whatever.

Healing signet is asking for trouble. 2 seconds activation is more than enough time for a signet to be disrupted and put out of use for 20 seconds with distracting shot. If you do manage to use it, you will be taking a hell of a lot of damage for two seconds and chances are at that point that you will be low on health and the warriors will have charged their adrenaline.

Granted it will get around backfire and the fact that you have little energy but I guarantee that a warrior or elementalist will do more damage in the 2 secs that you have ~20 AL than the healing you get from the signet.

In my opinion, dont use healing signet if you are a monk.

Entropius · Sep 04, 2005, 12:10 AM // 00:10

Not that heal sig is any good on monks, but running prot spirit will take care of it partially. You're still taking 45 damage from hit.

Almighty Zi · Sep 05, 2005, 04:05 PM // 16:05

I take onboard your point that protective spirit can cover while you use healing sig, however, the OP wanted work arounds for when he is shutdown. If you are shutdown then you either dont have the energy to cast or you have something blocking your casting such as backfire. Healing sig will get around these factors but in either of these cases you will not be in a position to use protective spirit. If you are able to cast protective spirit then you will be able to cast a healing spell instead of wasting two seconds and incurring an armour penalty from healing sig.